The Newly re-Modelled Baikal .222 Rifle

Started by Brithunter, March 30, 2005, 01:44:53 AM

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Brithunter

Hi All,
 
Thought it might be better to start off a new thread with the new look Baikal single shot rifle. After spending about a day or so re-shaping the wood, staining and applying a coat of BLO it looks like this :-
 

 

Old Look for comparison
 

 

 

 

 
So what do you think ????????????
 
To my eyes it's looks slimmer, sleeker and flows more with the lines of the stock matching the lines of the action. I am not too keen on the wood colour and if it does not darken down some with more oil, then I will strip the oil and possibly paint it like a synthetic stock for now until funds permit wood replacement.
Go Get them Floyd!

RatherBHuntin

Brithunter,
 I think you have made a world of differecnce on those stocks.  The forend is 100% better IMO.  THe pistol grip on the reat is much nicer as well, with the grooves you sanded out and all.  Very Very Very nice job.  You gotta be proud of the way it's turned out so far.  Have you had any thoughts of taking it back down and staining instead of painting if you dont like the finished color?
Glenn

"Politics is supposed to be the world\'s second oldest profession.  I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
Ronald Reagan

Brithunter

#2
Hi RatherBHuntin,
 
I have just got off the phone with a gunsmith who has told me to get some stuff from the chemists which will darken the wood and turn it more reddish, so I will get a-hold of some of that and give it a whirl after all I have not got a lot to lose and it may end up with a true oil finish, we will have to wait and see how it goes.
 
Oh I am glad you think it's an improvment, I wondered if it was just me wishing it to be so :o I can see what Jay means about that comb line not. perhaps it could have done with the front of it dropped a little.................. Oh well :rolleyes:
 
Edit :-
 
           Well got the cyrstals and I am soaking the stock in Nitro-Mores paint stripper now to remove the BLO I applied so fingers crossed ;)
Go Get them Floyd!

fish


LLANOJOHN (deceased)

BH,
 
Looks mighty good to this ol' country boy!  Your efforts were indeed an improvement!
 
Ol' John
Life Member-NRA-TSRA
Riflesmith-Bolt & Lever Centerfires Only
Left-Hand Creek Rifles
Mark Twain was right-"There is no such thing as too much good whiskey!"
My best advice.."Best to stay outta trees and offa windmills!"

Brithunter

Hi All,
 
      Yhankyou for you encouragement :D  Now just wait until you see the next installment ;)  Doing as i was told to do, I went to the chemist and brought some " POTASSIUM PERMANGANATE" cystals. Put about 1/2 a teaspoon in a small jar and added approx 100 ml od water and mixed it up so the crystals fully disolved and then painted in ont eh wood folowing the frain. This is a vivid Violet colour, I applied tow good soaking coats then wiped and rinsed it off with cold water. the rad the hair dryer over the wood to quickly dry the surface. The wood has not bee wet long wnough to soak it up, the Permanganate solution dries quite quickly and apparently unlike stains it actuall changes the colour of the wood fibres to a reddish brown.
 
       Once it was dry a wipe over with some 400 grit Wet N Dry to flatten down any raised grain and then a final burnish with 600 grit Wet N Dry. I then applied (which is still soaking itn/drying a coat of ALKANET ROOT OIL or Red oil as it sometimes known. The results already to my eyes at least look 100 times better than that stained finish. That darned stain cost me over £4 and the potassium crystals only  £1:11p, that a quarter of the price and a much...................... much better result :rolleyes:  Now it just needs several coats of Oil. This stock appear to be dry as the first application ofthe Alkanet oil has almost dried in the time it's taken me to type this out :eek: I am feeling beter about this rifle evey minute.
 
      Now the trigger is the only thing I really need to sort out on it :D  for it to be about perfect. Hmm this has gotten me thinking now, let's see how much it would take to convert on of them shotguns, I am thinking maybe a 6.5x53R , The thinking is that we can cut off the barrel and sleeve the rifle barrel into the barrel lumps like the Russians have done .............. OK John your thoughts on that
Go Get them Floyd!

Hunterbug

Looks good. You should bring it over when you come elk hunting and we'll hook up and chase a few coyotes. ;)
Ask not what your government can do for you. Ask how your government can go away and get out of your life.
 
 
The unarmed man is is not only defenseless, he is also contemptible.
Niccolo Machiavelli

drinksgin (deceased)

Brit;
Are the Baikal shotgun actions the same strength as the rifle actions?
I ask this because the H&R-NEF rifle and shotgun actions are very different and a rifle barrel cannot be fitted to a shotgun action, though a shotgun barrel can be fitted to a rifle action.
Does England have hardware stores with oil and water base dye preperations [aka wood stains] available?
Tung oil mixes are available here at good prices and can be used easily on stocks.
Don ;D
Don
NRA life, TSRA life, SAF life, GOA, CCRKBA, DEF -CON

Brithunter

#8
Hi drinksgin,
 
Yes I walked with the dog down to our local hardware store, it's one of the small old family type ones and has just about everything in stock. It' known for quite a distance as the place to get those hard to find things that you ahve always sed but the big superstore don't think you need or use want a Aliminium kettle for the stove top or campfire, you'll find one at Arthurs'. That's not the name od the shop, but the name of the guy who used to run it.
 
Anyway I brought some water based stain which prooved not to be much good, they also has oil based stain but that said apply only one coat and I might need to do more so. Any way I should have saved my money and got the potassium in the fist place, funny how the old methods are often the best. Rather than spend more money of an oil finish, I will have to use what I already have, which is a little Walnut oil preparation for Gunstocks and some BLO.
 
Once the light gets better I will take another photo of the stock in it's new colouring, weather has turned dark and damp. overcast and rainy. You almost have to have the lights on indoors and it's 08:00, when the cloud lifts it's light but 06:30, that's how miserble it is just now
 
Now as to the action strength, well until I carefully examine the shotgun ones I am not sure, but it sure looks the same so far. They are massivily overbuilt for a shotgun which is typical of the Russian Baikals. Infact it's often joked that's it's about impossible to wear a Baikal out, don't forget they were designed for years of hard service with minimal maintenance form poorly educated Russian peasents. Not born of the throw away era, just like the Russian nagant rifles solidly built ans effective in operation This is one reason why I am thinking of lightening the hammer in the rifle, it's simply far more massive than required, but at -40 degrees that huge hammer might just make the difference in working of not, but as I am never going to be found in those tempretures I will lighten it to gain a little more speed and a reduction in lock time. As it is I have already reduced the hamer spring a little but dry firing it the hammer hits home so hard you can see the scope shake. If nothing else in theory it should help accuracy with a shorter lock time but only time will tell on the range.
 
The Handi-Rifle is an exposed hammer design, I was not sure so I went to the HR site and took a look, not sure I like the exposed hammer designs styling, I suppose I ahve been brought up of "hammerless2 designs and styles, this Baikal reflects the styling of the "British" style of shotguns which I am more familar with so I suppose it looks more "right" to me
 
Edit :-
 
Here are the new photos as promised
 

 

 

 
 
A much more natural looking colour don't you think.
Go Get them Floyd!

Jay Edward (deceased)

Looking good BH, looking good.

I wonder if a fella could weld on to that triggerguard spur to create a loop type lever?  Uniqueness is a good quality.

Another method I used in the past is a propane torch, with a light hand, to bring out the grain.

Sleeving rifle barrels into shotgun break actions is a fairly common practice over here BH.  Cheap way to make up a double barrel .45-70 Govt.  

Interesting project.



Brithunter

Hi Jay,

     On this single barrel rifle, the Russians it seems have taken the Barrel lump forging, Bored & Threaded it for the rifle barrel. I am wondering if I can do this to the shotgun. I should have been looking at them this afternon, but plans went astray. This morning I went to see about trading off my No4T which is not all original as it's been rebuilt, something about it does not grab me and I am trading it off and getting not another military rifle, although the No1 Mk111 with the mag cut off was interesting, I am getting a very nice commercial sporting rifle conversion on a No4 Enfield in 303 plus a 1st pattern BSA Monarch in 270 Win. Why they all appear to be in 270 I do not know :rolleyes: (this will be my 3rd 270 in the cabinet) it's been a farmers "landie"  (Land Rover) gun from the look of it, very little bluing left and some scars to the stock finish but nothing that a re-finish cannot correct ;) and needs a darned good cleaning :(  not sure if the barrel is pitted inside or not but I have already check with Mr Knibbs and he has a brand new barrel for this model in 270 Win so that's not too much of a concern :D so this model following on from my Majestic fits rather nicely into my collection. The Monarch 1st pat being made from 1966-1970 with 2227 being made split between two prefix numbers.
 
       He also had a still new Parker-Hale No1 Mk11 Sporting rifle conversion but the price was a little steep on that one and although it was as newly converted by P-H, the barrel was only a good one and not a new replacement one, whilst the No4 conversion (not known who it was down by, as several companies here did these) has a very good barrel and the dealer has tested it at 100 yards with the issue No4 rear sight and using surplus MkV11 ammunition shot a 10 shot group from prone of 2" :D I looked over his range log regarding this rifle. The chap is ex forces and was in Iraq for the first go around a few years back.
 
      With it is coming a brand new set of P-H scope mounts, the reciever front ring was drilled/tapped in the conversion before the rifle was re-blued and the wood has been replaced by a nice set of "Sile" sporting Walnet wood with the rounded fore end and not the later angled fore end with the Rose Wood tip. Pistol grip is capped with Rose Wood though :) .When I get back from Mum & Dads I will have to send my licence off to be altered to allow me to pick them up.
 
     Well what with the chatting about things and then looking over the Enfields and the Monarch I was there for nearly 4 hours so it sort put things out somewhat :rolleyes:  Oh well :D
Go Get them Floyd!

Jay Edward (deceased)

You know BH...I'm a little concerned about the idea to convert the shotgun into a rifle. Looking back on the locking system, I'm not sure it can handle the pressure.

I went to the Baikal site: http://www.baikalinc.ru/eng/ and looked at the firearms. There seems to be a real difference in the two actions. The shotgun action would only have to handle pressure to about 12000-15000 psi. The rifle cartridges might approach 50000 psi.

I can't help but think that the locking mechanisms are different...the rifle looks heavier. I haven't been able to find action specs to reassure myself but I'm still concerned.

Here are the two firearms with apparently different actions.

LLANOJOHN (deceased)

BH,
 
When I first read your thoughts on sleeving a shotgun barrel to a rifle caliber, I too was concerned about the pressure differences.  Jay re-inforced my thinking with his post.  You might get by with something like the low pressure 25-35 or 30-30 Winchester----perhaps!  You would also have to have an extractor/ejector custom made....don't know if it would be worth it or not.  Something to consider, neighbor!
 
Ol' John
Life Member-NRA-TSRA
Riflesmith-Bolt & Lever Centerfires Only
Left-Hand Creek Rifles
Mark Twain was right-"There is no such thing as too much good whiskey!"
My best advice.."Best to stay outta trees and offa windmills!"

Brithunter

Hi Guys,

      Well until I get my hands upon the shotguns to have a real look I cannot say whether you have valid concerns of not. I too looked at a breakdown diagram of the actions and they seem to be the same. The main difference I see is that the rifle on has the dovetail formed onto the breech section of the barrel, the shotgun does not have that. The reciever of the rifle has the end of the rib for the shotgun and plain sides instead of the pressed engraving of the shotguns.
 
    As for the extractor .......................... no problem, I can either weld up the origianl and re-machine it, or make a new one. Machinist by trade don't you know. The work will have to be done at Dad's place as that's where the machines are and if I end up back there I may just have a go at making a chamber reamer, now you see I have the 7.62x51 take off barrel which used to be fitted to a Mauser target rifle, bore has a little wear but it's a good heavy barrel and I was thinking about cutting the chamber off re-threading it and fitting it to a Martini action, however it migh go better on this shotgun action and be chambered for the ole 30-30 cartridge :D
 
   Will know more on Monday after examining the actions, be good and keep safe. ;)
Go Get them Floyd!

kombi1976

Quote from: BrithunterAs for the extractor .......................... no problem, I can either weld up the origianl and re-machine it, or make a new one. Machinist by trade don't you know. The work will have to be done at Dad's place as that's where the machines are and if I end up back there I may just have a go at making a chamber reamer, now you see I have the 7.62x51 take off barrel which used to be fitted to a Mauser target rifle, bore has a little wear but it's a good heavy barrel and I was thinking about cutting the chamber off re-threading it and fitting it to a Martini action
Machinist or no, BH, you'd have a job and a half to convert a Martini of any size to 7.62x51. If it was .307 Win then perhaps but Martinis don't like rimless cases and while you can make them extract a rimless case it usually isn't worth the trouble.
And why bother mucking with a shotgun action to build a 30-30. H&R/NEF make perfectly good 30-30s that are accurate and cheap to boot. Too much risk in it I reckon.
Cheers & God Bless
22lr ~ 22 Hornet ~ 25-20 ~ 303/25 ~ 7mm-08 ~ 303 British ~ 310 Cadet ~ 9.3x62 ~ 450/400 N.E. 3"


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