Some time ago I told you guys/gals I would post a thread on the "17 Stinger" I designed back around 1980 or so. It wasn't something I really wanted to do but a couple of young friends I hunted with bought high end 22 cal. rifles with the idea the high price made them shoot better. For testing they bought bricks of about every 22 rimfire cartridge made. They had bricks of CCI Stingers, Rem. Yellow Jackets and Win. Wildcats. None of these shot good in their Kimbers and Anschutz's rifles. To get rid of them, they dumped them on me. Not having much use for them I decided to neck them down and reload just to see what they would do. Not having many 14 caliber bullets, I decided on the 17 caliber because I had scads of 17 bullets by several diffrent makers including my own make.
 
I started out by making forming dies out of 1/2 inch heat treated bolts. It took a bit of tinkering before I finally got things to work according to Hoyle. First off, I discovered they couldn't be necked down in one pass. The brass is too thin and brittle for this. It would have to be a two step operation. After getting the dies right the next problem was forming cases in a regular loading press. I made a bushing adapter for the 1/2- 20 thread dies but it was difficult to work with such small cases in a big cumbersome press, especially with my bummed up fingers. I wound up making a hand held press using a plunger type toggle clamp for the ram. The shell holder was no big deal. I had been through all this before when I made a setup for necking the 22 Mag. down to 17 caliber. The 22 Mag. is almost as big as the 22 Hornet and much easier for me to handle. Obviously, these cases can't be annealed.
 
The first cases I designed had 5/32 inch long necks and are much like Aguila 17 cartridges. The second design used a 3/32 inch long neck and is almost a dead ringer for the 17 Hornady cartridge. The first chambering was for the longer necked case but later I deepened the chamber for the short neck version. One is just as good as the other. The only rifle I chambered for these cartridges was a BSA Martini Cadet I converted to rimfire. I also made up a pistol for the first version but we won't get into that. I only used 25 gr. bullets because that is about the only thing I had back in those days. Mostly I loaded them with my own home made bullets. They were much cheaper. I now wish I had made up some bullets with cornmeal cores for it.
 
In the pictures there is cases for the original cartridge that were never used and loaded cartridges of the later design along with empty cases. Also pictures of the press and dies. Incidentally, the final forming die, (the short one) sizes the case so there is no need for an expander button. The first forming die also is used for bullet seating, eliminating another die. It is exceedingly easy to pull the 22 bullets, neck and load these little cartridges. I won't give any loading data but 2.5 grs. Bullseye makes an exceptionally accurate load with 25 gr. bullets.
 
This cartridge preceded the Hornady cartridge by something like 25 years. Much like the rumor that Bobby Knight designed and built the first inline muzzle loader in 1985. I was building inlines back in the mid 60's. Still have one of them. Undoubtedly someone did all this long before I did. ...........Paul H

That's neat stuff Paul.  Thanks for sharing.  If you don't mind telling, what 's the reasonable "range" for that 17 stinger w/25 grain bullet?

Nels

Nels, I don't really know what a reasonable range for the stinger is with 25 gr. bullets. I sighted it in at fifty yards and when I shot it at 100 there was a drop of around one inch. I don't think I shot it over 500 times before pulling the barrel and fooling around with something else equally foolish. I'm in the process of putting another barrel on the BSA for the Stinger. don't know why I bother. This is the cartridge Ackley wanted to put in his third handloaders book but he had to leave before it got to the publisher. It's a fun little cartridge. I shot into a treated pine 4X4 with it at close range and the bullet came out the other side clean enough to reload. That was using a Walker competition bullet. They had thick jackets...............Paul H

I've been thinking about what it would take to reload rimfires lately, especially since I saw a 100rd box of GreenTag for $14 last night! Years ago I bought a box of Lapua Midas for $11 and thought that was wayy too much. Even *cheap* .22's are expensive now.
 
I have heard of using a .25ACP shell holder, but since you are putting your force directly on the priming compound if you catch the shell by the rim, that doesn't sound like the best idea. What do you use Paul?
 
I was thinking that once the bullet is pulled (how do you pull your bullets "safely"?), you could do without a shell holder by knocking the cases out of the die with a dowel, like the Lee Loader setup, since the priming compound is around the outside, not the center. Or would this deform the thin rimfire cases too much and break up the priming compound?
 
And lately, I've even heard of re-priming rimfires using strike anywhere match heads ground up (the grinding part sounds very unsafe!).
 
Any pointers? Where can you get dies? I see that you made your own.
 
I guess buying a .22 Hornet is probably more sensible and cheaper, since I already have dies and a shellholder for that, but why should I let that stop me?

WOW Paul, that's very cool.

SS, rimfires that have already been fired cannot be reloaded, regardless of what anyone tells you. Look upon any information like that with a suspicious eye. All fired 22 rimfire cases are good for is making 22 bullet jackets but only if they are not plated. ..........A 25ACP shellholder cannot be used for the 22 rimfires when making diffrent cartridges of them. I made my own to fit. Forming 22 rimfire cases is no more dangerous than seating a primer in centerfire cases. Probably even safer. ...........Pulling lead bullets from rimfires only requires a pair of pliers. Hole the cartridge in one hand, grip the bullet with the pliers and rock the bullet from side to side. Takes nothing really. .......Nobody makes loading dies for the rimfires of any kind. ........The whole project is just a novelty. For the most part useless tinkering. Something Ackley more or less put me up to. He was good at things like that. Sure miss the old fart. ..........Incidentally, if anyone should want to make bullet jackets from fired 22 LR cases it is a worthwhile endeavor if you want really explosive bullets. When annealing cases for this purpose, be sure to put the empty cases in a container with a cover over it. Otherwise the residual priming mixture in the rims will pop sending the cases flying. This is especially important when using the wifes oven to anneal cases. It's difficult to explain why she keeps finding odd 22 rimfire cases in her oven.  ...........Paul H

Very cool

Yes, Paul, the inline flintlock , coil spring fired and completely enclosed action, was being sold in 1738 ,Stanislaus Paczelt of Bohemia was the designer and builder, examples in both single and double barrel models are in a museum in Germany.
A co. in SA is building, coil spring actuated , striker fired inlines from patent drawings filed in England in 1812, just 3 years after Forsyth designed the percussion cap.
The patent was held by Jean Pauley.
Really makes me laugh at the purists with their devotion to the side lock action.
The percussion side lock design is just the cheapest and easiest way to convert a flintlock to percussion, also requires the least brain drain.

Yes, Paul, the more you look the further back , the more little is new.Stanislaus Paczelt was making inline flintlocks with coil spring powered enclosed actions in 1738, a museum in Germany has some.
A co. in SA is making repro inline MLs, using patent drawings of Jean Pauley, who was making coil spring , striker fired, inline percussion guns in 1812, just 3 years after Forsyth invented the percussion cap.
I am amused by the purists who believe the side lock is the only way to make a percussion gun. The side lock, with drum and nipple, is just the cheapest and fastest way to convert a flintlock to percussion.

Cool stuff Paul. I like the reloading press.
 
Hey Don... where you been keeping yourself?
 
Paul

Paul, mostly sitting with Venie and keeping her pain under control and driving back and forth to Tyler to the Gastro, Cardio and Oncologist.
I am working on some loads for .410 in brass cases for open choke guns such as the snake charmer for small game, varmints and even up to deer and pigs within sensible ranges.
The fact current prices for .410 are 3-5 times what 20 and 12 ga. cost is the primary motivator for this program. I am using an old Topper with the last 2 " cut off to have an open choke.
Still need to find a good powder but have some very promising projectile types to work on.
So far, 4, .34" balls in a plastic shotcup has shown the most promise, 2" x 1" at 15 yds for 2 shots.