The .45-70... It just keeps getting better and better.

Started by gitano, April 18, 2005, 10:58:51 AM

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gitano

Ok, it doesn't seem like I can go to the range without taking the Buffalo Classic (.45-70). Until I get tired of it, you all are gonna hafta put up with the 'range reports'.
 
This time I stuck to three bullets at three ranges. The bullets are the 500 grain Lee Postell 3-radius-ogive, the Lee 405 grain flat-point, and a "factory" 405 using what looks like winchester's jacketed 405. The ranges were 25, 50, and 100 yds. I only shot the 500 at 25.
 
I'll start with "real" targets and follow with my 'virtual' targets, and I'll start with the 500 grain bullet. Here are its real targets.
 
The top picture is of the single 3-shot 25yd group and the first 3-shot 50yd group. The second picture is of the second 3-shot 50yd group, and the last picture is of the 2-shot 100yd group.
 
Paul
Be nicer than necessary.

fish

them's some big ol' bullets.
looks like a heap o' fun.
abiding in Him,
><>

gitano

Since I only shot the other two bullets at 50 and 100 yds, I'll combine their targets in this post. The first picture is of a -shot group at 50yds using the Silver Bullet; the second is a 7-shot group at 100. The third is a 3-shot group with the  "Factory" cartridge at 50 yds, and the fourth is the "Factory" cartridge at 100.

The 500g Postells were propelled by 50.0 grains of N-135, and the 405 Silver bullets by 52.0 grains of N-135. I don't know what the "factory cartridges were using.
 
The average muzzle velocities and their standard deviations are:
 
500 Postell - 1799 f/s, 29 f/s, N=11
405 Silver Bullet - 1801 f/s, 17 f/s, N = 10
405 "Factory" - 1849 f/s, 7 f/s, N = 6
 
Notice that the 500 was essentially going just as fast at the muzzle as the 405 Silver Bullet was! (Felt like it too!) With a ballistic coefficient of .447, that's a potent 300 yard cartridge.
 
I've decided not to bore you with the quantitative analysis. Suffice it to say that I am very pleased with the accuracy (precision) of the 500 Postell using 50.0 grains of N-135. Laser Cast's Silver Bullet did better with 50.0 grains of N-135 than with 52. And the "Factroy" round was better than any of my handloads. (I hate it when that happens. :( ) BUT... I think I know what's up with getting my loads better. They get better every time I go to the range, so I think I'm onto the 'problem'... not enough attention to detail while reloading. I am developing new reloading techniques with these .45-70 cases and cast bullets, and consistency seems to be critical... as of course it always is with precision reloading. It's just that "new techniques" and "consistency" are mutually exclusive.
 
Untill the next range event,
Paul
Be nicer than necessary.

gitano

Quote from: fishthem's some big ol' bullets.
looks like a heap o' fun.
abiding in Him,
><>
Fish... them's thumpers at both ends too. That 500 grain bullet doing 1800 f/s in a 9.5 pound gun generates 36+ ft-lbs of "free" recoil. This rifle has a steel cresent buttplate. That bullet and that load will stand you right up. The 1200 f/s black powder loads are MUCH more pleasant/fun to shoot. But MAN! you should see the dirt fly when those 500s hit the backstop. :D I really gotta shoot a buffalo with this rifle.
 
Paul
Be nicer than necessary.

Brithunter

Hi Gitano,

     Hey I know what you mean about the Mud flying :D I still vividly remember that house brick sized sod of earth at the 200 yard mantlet when I first tried my Swinburns patent Sporting rifle in 577/450 which was using Black Powder and a paper patched 480 grn soft lead bullet. The first shot went low, it was the first time I had fired the rifle and the first time I had loaded Black Powder:D  the sights, well I used the 100 yard standing express one then for the next shot flipped up the 200 yd leaf.
 
    The rifle roared and it had been raining earlier and the ground was wet, we were on the old Shorts 200 range at Bisley. The bullet struck low as I said and excavated a huge sod of earth the size of a house brick which lifted about 6 fot in the air before arcing back down. It was very impressive and I certainly do not ever want to be shot at by one of these monsters :rolleyes: if I remember correctly the load was 65 grn of Cartridge Pyrodex or 80 grains of FO triangel Black Powder, I tried both loads out, it sure was fun. I would like to get another of these 577/450 sporters as I traded this one away some years ago:rolleyes: would like an original unrestored one.
Go Get them Floyd!

gitano

Yup.
 
Swinburns patent Sporting rifle in 577/450
 
Can you scrounge up a picture of that rifle? Not necessarily the exact one, but a representative model?
 
Paul
Be nicer than necessary.

drinksgin (deceased)

I just had fist sized clumps of sod going 15-20 feet in the air from the 515gr at 1600fps.
Actually, the 210gr at 1600fps was doing almost that good, likely 10 feet high.
Don   ;D
NRA life, TSRA life, SAF life, GOA, CCRKBA, DEF -CON

gitano

Be nicer than necessary.

drinksgin (deceased)

Paul;
The Lee 5003R comes out 515 with gas check and LBT blue lube.
NRA life, TSRA life, SAF life, GOA, CCRKBA, DEF -CON

Brithunter

Hi Gitano,
 
This is the best I can do I am afraid to say, Never seemed to get around to taking a photo of the whole thing. Well if I di I have misplaced it over the years which is entirly possible :rolleyes: :-
 

As you can sww it's a Martini, the Swinburns Patent does not have the normal striker inside the breech bolt. But a hammer driven by a large Vee Spring in the wrist, it had an improved trigger pull as part of the design. I will see if I cannot get a didgital photo of the rifle as a friend has it now and I will ask. no promises though he may say No.
 

You will have to excuse the bolt form the BSA sporting rifle in the background:rolleyes: , the lever is the cocking lever and has a half cocked position so you can load a cartridge and then lower to half cock for stalking then when the beast appears snick it back to full coked and away you go.
 

Another thing which made it interesting, Battaue sights. It's thought it came from South Africa, te Butt had a very deep profile a bit like a trap gun but with the usual Red "Silvers" pad fitted. Swinburn on the left with the Ivory inlay to the Battaue sight 100yd stand, it then has leaves for 200 & 300Yd then the ladder flips up for 400-800 yards. BSA .303 sporting rifle on the right
Go Get them Floyd!

gitano

Thanks BH.
 
How can you turn loose of a thing of beauty like that?
 
Paul
Be nicer than necessary.

Brithunter

Hi Gitano,

        Well it was due to a number of things including a friend who had been badgering me about it. I also want an unaltered one, this one had been reblued at some time. They do come up occasionally but not often. I know some one who found a heavier one in .577. Eventually when they stripped it apart, it was all gummed up and jammed up with crud. They found the cartridge markings on the side of the breechblock. .577NE now that's a real beastie :eek: Oh he got it for a song too as the dealer thought is was .577 Snider which is not very popular for a sporting round. If it had been 577/450 the price would have doubled :eek:
Go Get them Floyd!

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