Because I have been contemplating loading a bunch of 16 ga and 28 ga ammo, I have been researching components and loads. I prefer paper hulls for 16 ga. (Not a serious "want", just a preference.) I have plenty of plastic hulls. Finally got some clear ones (plastic). I like those so I can see the components. A year or two after being loaded, I forget what I put in there sometimes. Especially when I'm developing loads.

Anyway... Shot is of course an important consideration, and like all us reloaders, I'm always looking to use the best components, and to extract the best performance from my handloads. To that end, I have been eye-balling the tungsten-based shots. The "global warming" "science" of the toxicity of lead aside, I have no real 'need' for tungsten shot. However, the primary reason I reject steel and "like" lead, is the density of lead. Steel and bismuth just can't "get there" in density, and therefore the ballistic coefficient of the pellet is lowered. (The higher the BC, the farther a pellet will carry its kinetic energy.) Pure tungsten, on the other hand, is almost twice the density of lead, BUT, pure tungsten has manufacturing issues and is in practice too brittle.

Of course, after 30+ years of gov't oppression based on nonsense "science", manufacturers have put together a tungsten alloy that not only "works" terminally, but is also denser than lead. I think there are now three different manufacturers of tungsten shot. One of them is ITX (http://tbammo.com/itx/), one is Hevi-Shot (http://www.ballisticproducts.com/Hevi-Shot/products/67/), and there's a new one on the block, Sphero Tungsten (http://www.ballisticproducts.com/SpheroTungsten-Shot-7-100-5-lb_bag/productinfo/HW07/).

ITX comes in two densities 10 and 13 grams per cc. Hevi-Shot has one density - 13 g/cc, and Sphero Tungsten 15 g/cc. (Pure lead density is 11.34 g/cc.)

Besides the fact that the denser shot will have a better ballistic coefficient (carry it's kinetic energy farther out), because of it's greater density, you can stuff more pellets of a given size in a give SPACE. Lemme 'splain.

One ounce of #6 LEAD shot has 225 pellets. (http://www.thehunterslife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12493)
One ounce of #6 Hevi-Shot has 225 pellets, BUT... TAKES UP LESS SPACE because the pellets are denser. Therefore, you have put more pellets in your shot cup.(The previous statement is not correct. See post number 5 below for the correction.) Of course, this extra weight means the velocity will be less (unless you change the wad and powder). BUT... more pellets means more pellets on the animal you are shooting. AND, they will probably have more energy when they get there. SO... tungsten alloy shot is "good" from a performance perspective. (An alternative is to go down a shot size with the tungsten alloy shot, and use a lighter load and make it go faster.)

However...

Here are the prices per pound for each, BEFORE shipping:
ITX-13 - $31.73
Hevi-Shot - $38.50
Sphero Tungsten - $36.99

Assuming a one-ounce charge of shot per round, (what I load in my 16 gauges), ignoring the cost of all other components, (hulls, primers, powder, and wads), AND SHIPPING, I would spend the following for SHOT ALONE for EACH round:
ITX-13 - $1.98
Hevi-Shot - $2.41
Sphero Tungsten - $2.31

Before shipping:
Primers cost me about 2 cents a piece
Hulls cost me about 11 cents a piece
Wads cost me about 4 cents a piece
Powder costs me about 7 cents per round
So total non-shot cost per round (excluding shipping) is about 24 cents. ONE TENTH THE COST OF THE SHOT!

Now, if I HANDLOAD my ammo, the CHEAPEST I can load tungsten alloy rounds is $2.42 per round. That's $60.50 PER BOX of 25 - FOR THE CHEAPEST. If I use Hevi-Shot shot, a box is going to cost me $66.25!

The @#$%^*&ing "ethicists" (ptooey) will argue that "Money is no object when it comes to ethical hunting. If you REALLY "care" about hunting, you will be willing to spend the money to ensure ethical killing." Implying of course, that if you don't agree with their point of view with regard to "ethics", (AND their bogus "science"), then you are not a "real" hunter. It's too easy for me to get wound up about this, so I'll let that krap go at this point. There's another point I want to make.

The anti-hunters AND the "ethical" sons-of-bachelors are WORKING TOGETHER to make hunting a rich man's 'sport'. An activity that only the well-heeled can AFFORD to participate in. In fact, they are so evil, that since common sense is the enemy of their propaganda lies, they have resorted to making LAWS that FORCE their will on those that KNOW their "science" is bogus. Ticks me off.

But...

My time, like the 'cowboy' before me, and the Indian before him, has passed. There is a new, more civilized, more domesticated, era before us. I understand that I am spitting into the wind. I only wish more of the "youngsters" could see the writing on the wall.

HERE'S THE BIG POINT: Unlike the cowboys and Indians, whose time was passed because of the reality of a changing world, these changes I note (a rich man's sport) are ONE HUNDRED PERCENT ARTIFICIALLY CREATED BY SONS OF BACHELORS THAT 1) Want to get MORE of your money, 2) want to "control" hunting into "nothingness" but some form of artificial afternoon 'sport', and 3) ultimately disarm all but the "approved" (RICH) for ownership of arms. Arms that are so emasculated that they are little more than toys.

So... I'm stickin' to lead I guess. I would dearly like to use the denser tungsten-based shot solely for its improved terminal performance, (the "ethicists" (ptooey) are right about that), AND for the fact that you can pack more pellets in a round if the density of the pellet is higher.

Paul

Paul, things like this irk me to no end. It's not just the shooting industry & their propaganda, it's cropping up in everything else too. Since the computer/cell phone age the sheeple are  suckers for all sorts of horse doo mostly because they can't think for themselves any more. There is no such thing as common sense & logic among the younger generations any more. All they know is  what some "expert or scientist" posted on the internet or told them in school. These "experts" use all sorts of propaganda to brainwash the people. Sure, denser material for shot is better than lead but the average person can't afford to load with it. Prices on ALL reloading components has gone up to the point where it's about as economical to buy factory ammo & hope for the best. Back in the summer I bought two pounds of Unique powder. Thirty dollars a pound. :cens: The monkey at the cash register tried to tell me what a bargain that was when I criticized their price. When I told him I used to buy it for $1.95 a pound he looked at me like I was from another planet. Made me want to reach out & touch someone. ......I don't shoot enough shot shells to pay me to reload. If I did I certainly wouldn't buy any exotic shot. It's simply not worth the cost.  .....What really ticks me off is every trade uses lies &  propaganda for their own personal & financial gain. The biggest lie going around right now is the flu & pneumonia vaccines. These vaccines right now is the biggest cause of the hospitals overfilled with serious flu cases. The media (ptooey) start telling the sheeple it's flu season. Better get your flu vaccination. 50% of the people getting flu vaccinations wind up with the flu. Then the stupid media tell people there's a flu epidemic,  better get your flu vaccination. People run out  & get flu vaccinations & cases double. It's stupidity. No common sense to see what's happening. Doctors & hospitals love it though.  .....I'll let it go at that before I really get started. .....Paul H

WOW! I guess it's time to start making your own shot. I bought some bismuth shells for Payton's 20ga at $15 for 10 shells. What sucks is that her shotgun is 2 3/4 only and the biggest non-toxic shot I can find locally is #5. I need to order some bigger stuff in case she gets into some geese.

Quote from: Hunterbug;150102WOW! I guess it's time to start making your own shot. I bought some bismuth shells for Payton's 20ga at $15 for 10 shells. What sucks is that her shotgun is 2 3/4 only and the biggest non-toxic shot I can find locally is #5. I need to order some bigger stuff in case she gets into some geese.

Yep! It's hard to find a 10 pound bags are $170 now. It's criminal!

I was rereading this thread, and realized I made a mistake in my calculations in the original post. (Where is drinksgin when you need him? )

QuoteOne ounce of #6 LEAD shot has 225 pellets. (http://www.thehunterslife.com/forums...ad.php?t=12493)
One ounce of #6 Hevi-Shot has 225 pellets, BUT... TAKES UP LESS SPACE because the pellets are denser.

The second statement CAN'T be true because shot SIZE - not weight - determines volume. Therefore, regardless of density, 225 pellets of #6 shot will occupy the same SPACE - regardless of the density of the material from which it is made.

What I should have said is that the shot cup that holds 1 ounce of LEAD #6 shot, will hold MORE than 1 ounce of #6 Hevi-Shot because the Hevi-Shot is denser. The "column" (#of pellets and volume occupied by those pellets), will be the same. But... the Hevi-shot load will be heavier.

Since Hevi-shot is approximately 15% heavier than lead shot, the 225 pellets of Hevi-Shot will weigh ~1.15 ounces instead of the 1 ounce of the lead shot. In units of weight we are more familiar with: The 225 pellets of lead (1 oz) is 437.5 grains. The 225 pellets of Hevi-Shot will weigh 501 grains. That's still a "big" deal when you are talking about powder charges, AND delivered energy.

Regardless, the issue of "rich man's sport" remains.

Paul

"For equal spheres in three dimensions the densest packing uses  approximately 74% of the volume. A random packing of equal spheres  generally has a density around 64%"